This and That

Time I made a blog post! What's been on my mind? Life hands us variety.

Let's start with a post I was reading on fb from a young devotee. She was under a lot of stress due to a significant problem, and not receiving help via authorities. The topic is not about her problem, that's not mine to share. The topic is how the Movement has changed so much that many new devotees aren't getting what we received. They don't have that spiritual family to count on, don't feel at peace within, and more of them leave than our generation. As I read her post, and all that happened to her, I felt sad. This is yet another reason to start your own at-home spiritual practice.

Some readers may feel my comments are anti-ISKCON but that is not my intent. Anyone who was around in the days when Prabhupada was on the planet knows full well that things have changed. Even those who, for quite a long time, did not want to admit it - admit it now. I still believe in Iskcon, just the one Srila Prabhupada created, and want to get back to that.

Anyway, I had to ask myself: "If I were young, would I join today?" I am not sure! That unnerved me a bit. What would happen to my spirit-soul? Therefore, had to think deeper. 

There are solutions. Take your instructions only from Jagat Guru, Srila Prabhupada. And start a small temple of your own 'safely' within your living quarters or regular meetings at a park in good weather, or etc. This way you surround yourself with safe people who also inspire. And practice peacefully, the bliss that is Krishna katha/ sravanam or hearing which includes reading nectar. 

Also, see the links throughout this blog on sidebar or below, regarding "how" to do that. 


Managing Director - new title for Temple President. 

 Why on earth change it? These little shifts are unnecessary, and adding up. While I'm sure they have some philosophical or convincing reason, I don't want to read it. Loaning an ear can be dangerous. Prabhupada instructed, don't change a thing! His instructions override any philosophy or convincing arguments they may create. Prabhupada said it - I therefore believe it. Managing Director has more of a mundane sound vibration to it than Temple President. Is it really turning into corporate Iskcon? Srila Prabhupada did not want that either. Matter of fact, he wanted the exact opposite.

       New Sanyasi's and the Sanyasa Ministry. 

I admit, I tend to keep my distance and did not know there was such a ministry; especially since I knew Prabhupada said, no more sannyasa. Yet there was a glaring post about it on fb. One devotee spoke of how wonderful the new candidates are, since most are Hindu or with a similar background - pointing out that they will be better than the Westerners who had emotional or mental issues.  

My thoughts? How do we know that merely because someone has a good record now, they will not mess it up later? That was the case with many of the Westerners who previously took sanyasa. 

Additionally, what makes one assume only Westerners can have emotional or mental issues but not those born in the East?  Of course there are many wonderful people born in the East, but that is a digression. For some of them there are mental or emotional issues as well. And some can turn out to be the same as Westerners, just initially covered over by the fortune of being birthed in India.

I also wonder if the standard which even the average devotee accepts, has become: Anyone who is nice, is pukka, is sattvic, is pundita, etc - they are qualified to take sannyasa.

Certainly we want all those qualities; simply it is not to end there. The reality we have seen is that very few make it through life with such extreme sense control. Those who take sanyasa, often later in life do feel urges - leading to a tendency to take it out on others. Mostly women and children, but also men whom they can belittle. 

So sannyasa is less about how much service someone has preformed, less about how much knowledge anyone compiled, and more about sense control - already on a high spiritual level where they see & treat everyone as spirit soul - plus being blissfully [& truthfully] absorbed in Krishna. They are joyous, not superficially so, not grumpy, certainly not materialistic [such as climbing the corporate ladder of Iskcon - that will not be an interest with a real sanyasa].

Are sanyasi's still given too many privileges? Fancy prasadam? Are they genuinely living a simple life without many servants, or different special advantages that often belong to the householder? Bank accounts? Cars? In this age Prabhupada has warned that some sanyasi's take these. 

If they are living in simplicity - that's great! However, can they maintain that for life? IMHO some applying to take sannyasa look too young. Sannyasa usually is not given until after 50 years of age, and usually after one has been married - thus real life experience. 

We learned the hard way. Most of them could not give advice to householders since most had not married, did not have children living at home, no job or bills to pay. Even, often gave bad advice. Spoiling with servants and so forth turned out to be a disservice to many of them. 

I do not know nor judge the upcoming. This is more about us. 

Devotees have a responsibility to be sufficiently studied to recognize first scripture than kali-yuga experiences that reveal exactly what should be expected for sannyasa initiation. Not mere sentiment of "this is better than that;" rather shastric requirements. Maybe when the power of the people :) kicks in, the Sannyasa Ministry will as well.

Srila Prabhupada put a lot of attention on the irrelevancy of material birth, caste, etc,. We should not think because some have a better background [or so some assume], therefore they won't form another type of fanaticism. Are we becoming Hindu's now? Out of desperation "this/hinduism" becomes better than "that/westerner?" Well, give up desperation and maintain standards Prabhupada gave us, which is off the bodily platform - because Hinduism is not our path. 

* More important are Prabhupada's instructions. When he said no more sannyasa, that should have been that. However, one devotee mentioned that the a guru told some to take sanyasa, even selected them. [We see how well that worked in N.V.  Not.] My reply here? A real guru never goes against the instructions of jagat guru. 

"This should be strictly outlawed, no more sannyasis." Srila Prabhupada Conversation, 7/1/1977

            Something Else Semi-Broke My heart. 

Only for a moment. I bounce back quickly. :)  It's actually not limited to one person, but am often reading: "They were such a lovely devotee, but they left - became very fallen." At this point I figured they lost interest in Bhakti Yoga. But no, keep on reading: "They became a ritvik, we should pray for them." Wow, my heart did a nose dive.

Sure, I get it that there are a lot of angry and uncontrolled ritviks out there. I've even posted around this blog for them to cease and desist such behavior. Simultaneously,  there are also a lot of mellow, sweet ones. They should not be lumped in together. 

With that said, we are not suppose to judge a philosophy by the people who try to practice it. We are to use our intellect and follow the instructions of the pure devotee Srila Prabhupada.  

The word 'ritvik,' came from the lotus lips of Srila Prabhupada. We had not heard of it before! Technically it's in our scripture, but so few knew this, that decades after his departure many claimed it was not. It was not a focal point when he was here. Thus, when he brought it up, it was news to us. Now, I'm not telling anyone what to believe. Just saying, hate for anybody is not very spiritual.  

                    Deity Shoes & Arotika 

Were did Prabhupada instruct to place Deity shoes upon the head at the end of arotika? It's not offensive, but not in line with our own Sampradaya. At least, that is what I was told when I researched and asked where this originated. I was informed: "the Ramanuja Sampradaya." Well, we are the "Brhama Sampradaya." To clarify, this is not a criticism of that activity, it's more about sticking with the instructions of jagat guru Srila Prabhupada. 

Some claim 'he instructed us to improve deity worship.' My two cents, 'sure, improve, but not to go outside our sampradaya as if what we were given was not enough.' If I am mistaken, all I need is a quote from Prabhupada or some type of proof that it's within the Brahma Sampradaya. Why others don't take up this issue, or find it important, is beyond me.

[From God/Krishna, to Brahma, all the way down to Srila Prabhupada. Our Sampradaya]

                Seats or sitting places to give class. 

When I joined, it was a small rug on the floor. So simple and blissful. In cold areas some were, well, catching a cold. Therefore, they elevated the seats by building a small box a few inches off the ground, on which they next put the rug on top. I don't mean a fancy box either. Not ugly, but not fancy. Very simple. 

Today, classes are given on a large, high seat. Too similar to a vyasana! Do not blame the person giving class. They have to sit somewhere. It is those who create such a standard, then enforce it in our temples word-wide, who need to correct this. Sitting on big seat above everyone else too easily takes away our humbleness. Please change it back to a rug or small box.

[I wanted to find a pic but without someone sitting on it, as that may detract from the real topic. Anyway, if you google a pic on the Vyasana that Srila Prabhupada sat on in the early days - and the so called regular seats used for giving class these days, well, you may be surprised at how similar they are.] 


                                         ABORTIONS. 

Such a touchy subject. However, saw a post about it so had to blog here, a balanced perspective.

This is not to debate whether it's right or wrong. All religions state that it's wrong. We ourselves agree with Prabhupada's instructions. Those are, the spirit soul is looking for a home - if there is abortion, they were kicked out, horribly. 

Now any reader who has had an abortion, if you take to Krishna Consciousness you can free yourself of that karma.  [In sync with avoiding the 10 Offenses, especially going forward, one must not sin on the strength of chanting.]

* With that summarized, now on to my point: Stop blaming only the women! We can not unite if total blame is placed upon woman. Fact is, I mostly heard of someone's boyfriend insisting she get an abortion! 

Additionally, I knew a girl, 15 years old, who became pregnant. She went alone to a place to eat. A man [her boyfriend's friend] told her to get an abortion. In all fairness I should mention, her boyfriend did not want her to get an abortion. She was very strong and replied 'no' to that man. But most of these young girls are not as strong. They're still growing up, and some adults are just growing. It takes some people more time than others to develop such courage, or gain more insight into all it involves. 

Also many years ago :) oh around the 1980's, I saw an advertisement from New Agers giving seminars and get-together circles just for women who had an abortion and could not get over it. They were holding hands in a large circle, doing some therapy and maybe some singing. 

One should stop and reflect: "Why would such therapy be given if all women who got an abortion really wanted to so voluntarily, and/or were genuinely informed?"

Parents also force abortions on their daughters. I recall one young woman in a chat room years ago who was mentally challenged, going out of her way to get pregnant. She finally achieved her goal. Her parents forced her to abort the child. To be mentally challenged is not justifiable, they have a right to children too, and those children have a right to life. Anyhow, that is but one example. There are many more where parents forced an abortion, tho the reader may have heard of them as well. [In all fairness, many parents are supportive of keeping the baby, or adoption.]

Sure, women are not off the hook, but they have all ready been taking the blame. That's imbalanced, as there are many who can contribute to someone undergoing an abortion. Including doctors and medical staff, specifically those who tell them there is no life yet. However, that's simply not true.

Therefore, boyfriends, parents, or someone they met out and about, who encouraged or guilted them to get an abortion - play a role as well. Especially those who either have physical control or psychological power over her. There's plenty of blame to go around, not only the female. :)

Let us take the attention away from blame, and place it more on spreading the concept to not do it. Instead, give a baby for adoption, or some other alternative. But let the world know - babies are alive upon conception; and really, before it. That spirit soul was just seeking a home in a mothers womb. 

Though if you choose to speak about abortion, do so carefully, because hurting an all ready hurting woman, in most cases does not help her surrender unto you. :) Rather, it results in the opposite.

Therefore, we all know God/Krishna can forgive anyone for anything. 

                         Let us focus on God.
More focus on Krishna, with encouraging such women to hear/read, and chant.  Also include any doctors, family, etc who sincerely want to free themselves - they can do the same. Hearing, chanting, transcending. <3

Related Post:

Becoming Free

Forgiveness

Recently there has been some online facebook discussion about forgiveness. A devotee gave a talk on the topic - and there are many opinions regarding his ideas.

Some are very favorable to it, pointing out how Prabhupada said we should forgive minor offenses. Yes, he did.

Others feel that medium and particularly severe abuses are grave, and such offenders should not be allowed to slide. They too pointed out Prabhupada quotes which support their understanding. Furthermore, that abusers have the tendency to be repeat offenders when left unchecked.

This blog post is not about the speaker, or the various devotees, just my two cents and experience with the issue.

Those in the first category were stating that forgiveness is more for yourself, a type of letting go in order to move on, so you can heal. I agree with that for minor offenses.

Those in the 2nd category were pointing out it's just a way to brush under the rug, the medium and chiefly large abuses someone committed. I agree with that too.

The first group became more specific and pointed toward forgiveness as good for your health. Remove the anger, hate, blame, resentment, worry - and watch your health blossom. Again, I agree.

Since some were including a philosophy of "my karma - my fault," the second group debated that point strongly.  I also take issue with that version of the karma belief - only because it's often a misunderstanding of laws of karma, it's far too speculative, can be misused by bad guys to blame the victim, plus a new adaption of a former misunderstanding. 

One godsister expressed that forgiveness does not always result in healing for those who experienced intense abuse, quoting a therapist.  Summed up, she elucidated:

Psychologist Alice Miller explains that asking a victim to forgive prior to the offender undergoing justice has been done and their victims nevertheless continued to experience suffering from the effects. It actually compounds trauma. What they really need to hear is unmoving condemnation of whatever bad thing happened. THAT is when real healing can begin. 

 

And, the offender must comprehend the depth of pain they caused those they offended, which is shown through (genuine) remorse followed by an honest apology - not lip service apologies.

This is what helps those outright abused to heal, since they no longer feel alone, but rather the world, in our case Movement, is with them. That we know and acknowledge they did not deserve it. This lifts a big burden off their shoulder, and from their inner dialogue. 

Completely agree with Alice. Plus, find one difficulty between the two groups belief systems - they often did not distinguish between the level of offense, or abuse. That is important and when omitted, can result in much argumentation, as we can see. :)

Found myself in the midst of going back and forth, trying to figure out which side made the most sensible points, in order to pick sides. 

While glad to have looked at both, and stand by what I wrote above - however, there I was reading many comments - my head getting a bit dizzy lol - when it hit me:

Why is there so much talk about forgiveness lately? Is it about people trying to get off the hook without making internal changes? Or is it about others who feel hurt? Our focal point use to be Krishna-Katha [talk of God.] I believe in forgiveness. But as devotees who took vows, why are many still living in a way to easily be able to make offenses in the first place? We should be living the blissful lifestyle of the disciple, which includes kindness toward one another - and others. Then there would be less offenses or abuse; less need to ask forgiveness - not more. Hence, I wondered, why so many offenses without solutions, when we have such  transcendental teachings and took vows?

Although I know the answers, am trying to aim this dialogue toward something higher. 

Quotes from Prabhupada instruct us to behave like ladies and gentlemen [gentle men!], and that the devotional lifestyle is one of sense control - not the mind and senses gone wild. Other quotes of his tell us to be kind, respectful, and more. 

When the opposite goes on, leading to a need to repeatedly put a band-aid over it, it may reveal a lack of genuinely following Prabhupada when no one is looking. Or they 'think' no one is looking. 

I actually had this happen years ago. Getting online for the first time ever, I was looking forward to finding many lovely devotees for association. 

What I found were some making snide, sarcastic comments to another devotee - something most would never do when living in the temple, or on temple property, or even nearby renting from a nondevotee. 

Others were using some of the lowest-class swear words.

Good grief, they must have forgotten God and Guru are up there watching them. Plus, they are maintaining low consciousness. Doing it with intent, because a person is their real self when no one is over their shoulder. Then, the truth comes out.

Fortunately I also found many sane, lovely devotees online. But back in the day, if you took initiation, you towed the line regardless of situation. You understood that you are a representative of Srila Prabhupada.

With that said, looking at the current discussions on forgiveness and offenses - the real issue seems to be less about forgiveness and more about honestly following. I need to get this out there and off my chest:

Offenders and especially abusers - knock it off! To continue to intentionally do such things, is going against Srila Prabhupada and Krishna. And come-on, you know it's a heavy pressure to keep doing or speaking wrong things. You want to be better, so if you need professional help - go get it. If you don't, the consequences may be more serious than you expected.

Do live the lifestyle we were taught to live, even if no one is looking. Renounce excuseism and start to be a self-controlled, loving, peaceful example that would please Prabhupada and Krishna. 

And for everyone else - it's not that hard to live the lifestyle - human beings make it hard. How? Brushing serious abuse under the carpet, as well as minimizing smaller offenses to the point that it was uncommon to say "I'm sorry," for decades. 

One example of the later: I read of someone who owed an acquaintance an apology, respond that they did not believe in apologies as long as they are a devotee - plus live life right. Wow, how startling! Where is the humility? No, this is not our philosophy. Prabhupada speaks about offering apologies. So we see even for the small offenses, asking forgiveness is necessary for spiritual life to progress nicely.

Next, how else do conditioned souls make living the lifestyle hard? By protecting known abusers and not arresting them. Stop trying to preach to them when they're first caught, which we know by now doesn't truthfully work. And cease giving them a ticket to India for 'purification.' As some friends have joked: "I have never been to India, guess I should do something wrong to get a free trip there." ha I suspect that has stopped now, but ya never know.

How else do humans make it hard? Politics. Need I say more?  

Stinking thinking is another way. Some [not all] do this in the name of God. Yes, they believe they can lie, cheat, steal, etc - as long as they are doing it for the Lord. This can open the door to word jugglery, making promises to the less powerful devotee they later do not keep, as just one example. When those in positions of power do such things, first they're presenting it as if it is our lifestyle when it is not. Also, they make it difficult for others to want to continue to follow the Bhakti way of life, hard to pick it up again. Do not turn your power over to them. Make sure any instructions are in sync with Prabhupada's books, lectures, etc.

[Funny - but do recognize stinking-thinking when you hear it.]

There can be a long list of how we make living the lifestyle hard. Too much to get into, especially since my original intent of this post was:

We will need less focus on forgiveness when we start truthfully following properly - live the lifestyle even when no one is observing you. Prabhupada outlined a beautiful lifestyle for us. Things go wrong when it is not properly employed. Use it, or loose it.

 
Additionally, some [not all] want initiation, yet do not want to give up, for example, mistreatment of others. Now they (think they) can do it in the name of God. Maybe hot tempers, maybe ADHD, maybe something else. Or some may really be trying but can't make much progress with those listening.

Bottom line? Most of us are not that advanced, let it go and stick with the nectar of Prabhupada quotes.  

When preaching something higher, sublime - people are helped more than when fault-finding. Pick your association wisely.

If one takes spiritual initiation - behave spiritually. Surrender the ego without looking for loopholes in shastra. Being honest = moving forward. Using trickery = moving backwards or freezing, knowingly and often unknowingly..

It's easy to follow the lifestyle. Not suggesting anyone must be perfect, just to keep "sincerely" trying. And it sure does not involve all the above drama, or trauma.

It's why I have links throughout and below this blog to help those interested, practice Krishna Consciousness at home. Than there are no big wigs to get in your way or create confusion that may block you from making spiritual advancement. No wrong association passed off as right. No <fill in the blank>.

When Prabhupada was on the planet, classes were about how to practice Krishna Consciousness, when to practice Krishna Consciousness, where to practice Krishna Consciousness, the joy of Krishna Consciousness, the end of repeated birth, death, and suffering when absorbed in Krishna Consciousness. Now there is so much talk of other topics.

Please don't misunderstand. Certainly we should not be too puffed up to offer an apology over minor offenses. To make a small offense is unfortunately, a part of normal life in kali-yuga. This is the era we live in, and how it is set up. All the more reason to offer a 'genuine' apology when we make a minor offense. Just say it and get it over with. :)

Simultaneously, the more we honestly live the sublime lifestyle, breathe it, bring it into our heart by reading daily, singing daily, listening to divine music daily, dancing daily, etc - then we get purified and automatically there are less offenses committed. 

. 
Those of us who are priests and nuns should be setting the example. Sure, much changed after Prabhupada left the planet, and it left many of us weak. Weak, not dead. lol 

So we should do what we can - but stop serious abuse by taking immediate action against confirmed abusers, because when they "know" they will not get a mere slap on the hand, but rigid consequences, watch the abuse numbers drop profoundly.

In other countries where laws are strict, they have lower numbers of abusers than we do in the West. Not suggesting to copy their laws, or not copy them. I have not looked deeply into them. What I am saying is - this is evidence that when abusers know the reactions will be serious actions taken against them - it works to make most of them stop. They actually control themselves! [Which is proof they can!] No one wants to go to prison!. 

And of course let us remember to include the small offenses, which are still hurtful. IMHO the way to reduce them is by owning our contribution if we contributed - plus actively applying the process Prabhupada gave us. That is the way to bliss, happiness, and especially to Krishna..

 I agree with the point that if we need an apology from someone and are not getting it - we should not keep holding our breath, but instead move forward with our spiritual life. IMHO waiting for an unlikely apology is giving away your power.

Simply, I do not believe resolving such a need is "one size fits all" forgiveness-therapy. :) What works for some, will not work for others.  

If you doubt this, ask any Gurukuli who attended a festival and saw their former abuser enjoying himself there. Gurukuli's have clearly expressed how that made them feel - decades later. When the offense is large, in most cases justice must be taken before the victim can feel sufficient relief. Even before the abuser can experience genuine remorse! Remorse is a known requirement for a real apology, otherwise it's just lip service.

Moving on, it's really not a good idea to give lectures that are more like therapy. Sure, we may need some of that, but it should be outside the Movement instead of a big glorified thing in the Movement. 

When Prabhupada gave class, he always spoke about spiritual life. When he instructed us to give classes, he said to speak our realizations [about God]. It was such an exciting time period. We thought it would never end. It doesn't have to, as long as we keep the excitement going by keeping Prabhupada's technique at the forefront.

 All lectures in the temple room etc should be about the blissful glories of Krishna, the Supreme Personality of Godhead.  To hear about Him will result in a lot of healing! We have seen. It can change a person for the better. 

What if for some, it does not bring healing? Then the individual should seek out a professional. There is no harm nor shame in that. 

I appreciate the various devotees who try to help via therapy. Please do it in your office, your tiny apartment, your large house, heck write a blog post with tips - just do not do it within the Movement..  

IMHO, those who did not attend college to make a thorough study of therapy or counseling - and complete it with a certificate on their wall - can cause more damage than the intended help. Get your education first. And do not experiment on devotees..

Thirty years ago I had this happen to myself, as well as some of my friends. There was a popular group of devotees following a certain self-help book. I'm not against self-help books, at all. But this one felt fishy to me, cult-like. I refused to join their club..

  Oddly these things work for some, because everyone is an individual. However, when it came to people it did not work for, those who did follow this author wrote ostracized them in social settings. . 

Truth is, they really did not know what to do with anyone who thought differently from themselves, or didn't fit in the box. Suggestive to me that they were not really as qualified as they viewed themselves. [Neither was that author.] Matter of fact, it simultaneously reminded me of fundamental religions where you are either going to heaven or hell, no other understanding or philosophy allowed..

If some readers think that is why I write this post, that it was a trigger for me, or yada yada - no. Like I said, it was 30 years ago and a learning experience. I got the message and now hope devotees who mean well by including therapy in their lectures or seminars - will also get the message that it takes many years of specific study to give "group" talks on such an intertwined and complex subject. Many will have different issues, different backgrounds - thus different healing needs. They will not all fit in with the group..

With that said phew ha, I'd like to circle back to the original or main intent of this post, that we go to temple to hear about God. Prabhupada gave us something very special, and for that matter, rare in kali-yuga.  Countless other places on this planet offer counseling; there are far fewer that offer Krishna Consciousness - especially connected to ShaktyaveshAvatara.

There will be less offenses, less abuse, less need to ask forgiveness or give it - if we "truthfully" follow Prabhupada's outlined program. It will keep us joyfully busy, and it will keep our thoughts on a higher level.

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